Acknowledgement sent
to Juha Jäykkä <[email protected]>:
New Bug report received and forwarded. Copy sent to Debian ALSA Maintainers <[email protected]>.
(Sun, 20 Nov 2016 10:42:04 GMT) (full text, mbox, link).
Package: alsa-utils
Version: 1.0.28-1
Severity: normal
File: /usr/bin/alsamixer
Dear Maintainer,
Running "alsamixer -c0" in order to adjust the ALSA mixer levels causes
pulseaudio daemon to start. This is not just wrong and unexpected, but
also causes unwanted side-effects in other programs, like mixer levels
changing and other programs suddenly defaulting to using pa.
Cheers,
Juha
-- System Information:
Debian Release: 8.5
APT prefers stable
APT policy: (995, 'stable'), (500, 'stable-updates'), (500, 'testing')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)
Foreign Architectures: i386
Kernel: Linux 3.16.0-4-amd64 (SMP w/2 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_GB.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=fi_FI.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8) (ignored: LC_ALL set to en_GB.UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/bash
Init: sysvinit (via /sbin/init)
Versions of packages alsa-utils depends on:
ii dialog 1.2-20140911-1
ii kmod 18-3
ii libasound2 1.0.28-1
ii libc6 2.19-18+deb8u6
ii libncursesw5 5.9+20140913-1+b1
ii libsamplerate0 0.1.8-8
ii libtinfo5 5.9+20140913-1+b1
ii lsb-base 4.1+Debian13+nmu1
ii whiptail 0.52.17-1+b1
alsa-utils recommends no packages.
alsa-utils suggests no packages.
-- Configuration Files:
/etc/init.d/alsa-utils changed [not included]
-- no debconf information
Acknowledgement sent
to Elimar Riesebieter <[email protected]>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Debian ALSA Maintainers <[email protected]>.
(Sun, 20 Nov 2016 13:39:06 GMT) (full text, mbox, link).
* Juha Jäykkä <[email protected]> [2016-11-20 10:12 +0000]:
> Package: alsa-utils
> Version: 1.0.28-1
> Severity: normal
> File: /usr/bin/alsamixer
>
> Dear Maintainer,
>
> Running "alsamixer -c0" in order to adjust the ALSA mixer levels causes
> pulseaudio daemon to start. This is not just wrong and unexpected, but
> also causes unwanted side-effects in other programs, like mixer levels
> changing and other programs suddenly defaulting to using pa.
alsamixer doesn't fire up any puls daemon. Please check whether
puls is running before starting alsamixer.
BTW: do you have more then one soundcard installed? If not just run
alsamixer without any option.
Elimar
--
Obviously the human brain works like a computer.
Since there are no stupid computers humans can't be stupid.
There are just a few running with Windows or even CE ;-)
> alsamixer doesn't fire up any puls daemon. Please check whether
> puls is running before starting alsamixer.
It should not, but it certainly does:
juhaj@meissa 18:07:16 ~> ps -flyu juhaj|grep pulseau
S juhaj 9740 9724 0 99 19 2204 3488 - 18:07 pts/4 00:00:00
grep pulseau
Today is 20.11.2016, I am running on tty 4 and currently controlling 0 jobs
juhaj@meissa 18:07:31 ~> alsamixer -c0
/usr/bin/pulseaudio: line 3: /var/log/mpd/mpd.runs.pulseaudio.at: Permission
denied
W: [pulseaudio.real] main.c: /proc/self/exe does not point to /usr/bin/
pulseaudio, cannot self execute. Are you playing games?
Today is 20.11.2016, I am running on tty 4 and currently controlling 0 jobs
juhaj@meissa 18:07:39 ~> ps -flyu juhaj|grep pulseau
S juhaj 9746 1 7 69 -11 10840 166267 - 18:07 ? 00:00:00 /
usr/bin/pulseaudio.real --start --log-target=syslog
S juhaj 9752 9746 0 80 0 5336 30992 - 18:07 ? 00:00:00 /
usr/lib/pulseaudio/pulse/gconf-helper
S juhaj 9756 9724 0 99 19 2160 3488 - 18:07 pts/4 00:00:00
grep pulseau
Today is 20.11.2016, I am running on tty 4 and currently controlling 0 jobs
juhaj@meissa 18:07:40 ~>
I do not think this behaviour is correct. The user juhaj is pristine, and
default.pa comes from the deb, except I've added
load-module module-alsa-sink device=dmix:CARD=AudioPCI,DEV=1
just before
.ifexists module-udev-detect.so
load-module module-udev-detect
.else
### Use the static hardware detection module (for systems that lack udev
support)
load-module module-detect
.endif
> BTW: do you have more then one soundcard installed? If not just run
> alsamixer without any option.
Your guess is correct. A total of three soundcards, although only two are
relevant here: the third one is a webcam which only has a microphone, no
speakers.
Now that you mention it, while alsamixer -c1 and alsamixer -c2 also start
pulseaudio, only alsamixer -c0 causes any volumes to change.
Which makes me wonder perhaps
load-module module-alsa-sink device=dmix:CARD=AudioPCI,DEV=1
has something to do with the changing of the mute setting. Having said that, I
don't really mind if pulseaudio gets started as long as it does not screw up
the mixer settings in the process: I can always configure other software to
use alsa explicitly if I need to.
So I still think the problem is that pulseaudio gets started in the first
place.
Cheers,
Juha
Acknowledgement sent
to Elimar Riesebieter <[email protected]>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Debian ALSA Maintainers <[email protected]>.
(Thu, 24 Nov 2016 07:39:03 GMT) (full text, mbox, link).
Control: tags -1 unreproducible
* Juha Jäykkä <[email protected]> [2016-11-20 18:15 +0000]:
> > alsamixer doesn't fire up any puls daemon. Please check whether
> > puls is running before starting alsamixer.
>
> It should not, but it certainly does:
>
> juhaj@meissa 18:07:16 ~> ps -flyu juhaj|grep pulseau
> S juhaj 9740 9724 0 99 19 2204 3488 - 18:07 pts/4 00:00:00
> grep pulseau
> Today is 20.11.2016, I am running on tty 4 and currently controlling 0 jobs
> juhaj@meissa 18:07:31 ~> alsamixer -c0
> /usr/bin/pulseaudio: line 3: /var/log/mpd/mpd.runs.pulseaudio.at: Permission
> denied
> W: [pulseaudio.real] main.c: /proc/self/exe does not point to /usr/bin/
> pulseaudio, cannot self execute. Are you playing games?
> Today is 20.11.2016, I am running on tty 4 and currently controlling 0 jobs
> juhaj@meissa 18:07:39 ~> ps -flyu juhaj|grep pulseau
> S juhaj 9746 1 7 69 -11 10840 166267 - 18:07 ? 00:00:00 /
> usr/bin/pulseaudio.real --start --log-target=syslog
> S juhaj 9752 9746 0 80 0 5336 30992 - 18:07 ? 00:00:00 /
> usr/lib/pulseaudio/pulse/gconf-helper
> S juhaj 9756 9724 0 99 19 2160 3488 - 18:07 pts/4 00:00:00
> grep pulseau
> Today is 20.11.2016, I am running on tty 4 and currently controlling 0 jobs
> juhaj@meissa 18:07:40 ~>
What do you want to tell me here? It seems your pulseaudio
installation is a bit buggy. I can't reproduce.
> I do not think this behaviour is correct. The user juhaj is pristine, and
> default.pa comes from the deb, except I've added
default.pa comes from pulseaudio or xrdp package. There is no
instruction to start pulse in any alsa package.
> load-module module-alsa-sink device=dmix:CARD=AudioPCI,DEV=1
>
> just before
>
> .ifexists module-udev-detect.so
> load-module module-udev-detect
> .else
> ### Use the static hardware detection module (for systems that lack udev
> support)
> load-module module-detect
> .endif
>
> > BTW: do you have more then one soundcard installed? If not just run
> > alsamixer without any option.
>
> Your guess is correct. A total of three soundcards, although only two are
> relevant here: the third one is a webcam which only has a microphone, no
> speakers.
>
> Now that you mention it, while alsamixer -c1 and alsamixer -c2 also start
> pulseaudio, only alsamixer -c0 causes any volumes to change.
>
> Which makes me wonder perhaps
>
> load-module module-alsa-sink device=dmix:CARD=AudioPCI,DEV=1
>
> has something to do with the changing of the mute setting. Having said that, I
> don't really mind if pulseaudio gets started as long as it does not screw up
> the mixer settings in the process: I can always configure other software to
> use alsa explicitly if I need to.
>
> So I still think the problem is that pulseaudio gets started in the first
> place.
It seems that pulse is fired up by mpd?
Elimar
--
355/113: Not the famous irrational number pi,
but an incredible simulation!
-unknown
> What do you want to tell me here? It seems your pulseaudio
> installation is a bit buggy. I can't reproduce.
Apart from the bit about /usr/bin/pulseaudio being a script which simply
records that pulseaudio has been started and then execs /usr/bin/
pulseaudio.real, pulseaudio and alsamixer are pristine jessie. The
asound.conf, which does not refer to pulseaudio at all, is modified;
default.pa is also modified, but it should not even be read in this case.
I'm sorry I forgot to remove that debugging script at /usr/bin/pulseaudio but
the result is the same with that removed.
> default.pa comes from pulseaudio or xrdp package. There is no
> instruction to start pulse in any alsa package.
You are quite correct. The culprit is /usr/share/alsa/alsa.conf.d/pulse.conf
placed there by the package pulseaudio. If you install pulseaudio and that
file then exists, can you then reproduce? (Please see my very last paragraph,
too!)
Is this now a bug in pulseaudio? And what severity? I'd say this breaks
unrelated software!
> It seems that pulse is fired up by mpd?
I think pulseaudio gets started by libasound.so.2 when it parses alsa.conf.d
because pulseaudio has placed the above file there.
Interestingly enough, said file starts with a comment:
# PulseAudio alsa plugin configuration file to set the pulseaudio plugin as
# default output for applications using alsa when pulseaudio is running.
I would agree that this is probably the most commonly desired behaviour *when*
pulseaudio is running. However, I would not expect this to start a fresh
pulseaudio daemon when one is *not* running yet!
One further bit of information which I just realised might be relevant: there
is a pulseaudio server running on the machine, but it belongs to another user.
Could it be pulseaudio/alsa just naively think "pulseaudio running, let's use
it" without considering whether they actually *can* use it or not? And when it
cannot be used, a new daemon is fired up? Just guessing.
Cheers,
Juha
Acknowledgement sent
to Elimar Riesebieter <[email protected]>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Debian ALSA Maintainers <[email protected]>.
(Sun, 18 Dec 2016 12:39:04 GMT) (full text, mbox, link).
* Juha Jäykkä <[email protected]> [2016-11-26 19:09 +0000]:
[...]
> I think pulseaudio gets started by libasound.so.2 when it parses alsa.conf.d
> because pulseaudio has placed the above file there.
If pulsaudion is installed it runs as a per user session by default.
To prevent starting pulse just
$ echo "autospawn=no" >> $HOME/.pulse/client.conf.
You can now kill the pulseaudio process with out restarting it
again. See alsa /usr/share/doc/pulseaudio/README.Debian.
To make this as a default I have this in my shell login script
(i.e .zlogin)
echo " Shutdown pulseaudio"
if [ -x /usr/bin/pulseaudio ]; then
if [ "$(pulseaudio --check 2>/dev/null)" = 0 ]; then
pulseaudio -k
else
echo " No pulsedaemon found"
fi
fi
Elimar
--
.~.
/V\ L I N U X
/( )\ >Phear the Penguin<
^^-^^
> > I think pulseaudio gets started by libasound.so.2 when it parses
> > alsa.conf.d because pulseaudio has placed the above file there.
> If pulsaudion is installed it runs as a per user session by default.
I think you might have misunderstood the problem. Disabling pulseaudio's
autospawn does not fix the bug, it merely hides it in many circumstances.
Furthermore, in my case, I actually want to keep autospawn – for those
programs which actually wants to use pulseaudio. But at the same time, I want
alsamixer -c0 (and a host of other programs) not to mute my mixer.
Cheers,
Juha
Acknowledgement sent
to Elimar Riesebieter <[email protected]>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Debian ALSA Maintainers <[email protected]>.
(Mon, 19 Dec 2016 09:21:05 GMT) (full text, mbox, link).
* Juha Jäykkä <[email protected]> [2016-12-18 23:02 +0000]:
> > > I think pulseaudio gets started by libasound.so.2 when it parses
> > > alsa.conf.d because pulseaudio has placed the above file there.
> > If pulsaudio is installed it runs as a per user session by default.
>
> I think you might have misunderstood the problem. Disabling pulseaudio's
> autospawn does not fix the bug, it merely hides it in many circumstances.
>
> Furthermore, in my case, I actually want to keep autospawn – for those
> programs which actually wants to use pulseaudio. But at the same time, I want
> alsamixer -c0 (and a host of other programs) not to mute my mixer.
I think the only chance to run alsamixer without starting pulse is
to pulseaudio -k and autospawn pulse.
Elimar
--
Obviously the human brain works like a computer.
Since there are no stupid computers humans can't be stupid.
There are just a few running with Windows or even CE ;-)
Acknowledgement sent
to Elimar Riesebieter <[email protected]>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Debian ALSA Maintainers <[email protected]>.
(Thu, 22 Dec 2016 09:30:03 GMT) (full text, mbox, link).
* Juha Jäykkä <[email protected]> [2016-12-21 21:21 +0000]:
> > I think the only chance to run alsamixer without starting pulse is
> > to pulseaudio -k and autospawn pulse.
>
> Is this not a bug?
Starting pulseaudio automagic is a feature implemented in pulseaudio;-)
Elimar
--
Numeric stability is probably not all that
important when you're guessing;-)
> > > I think the only chance to run alsamixer without starting pulse is
> > > to pulseaudio -k and autospawn pulse.
> > Is this not a bug?
> Starting pulseaudio automagic is a feature implemented in pulseaudio;-)
So in short, it's either all or nothing? I.e. if I want *some* programs, which
are linked against libpulse0, *not* to mess my mixer settings up because
libpulse0 automagically starts pulseudio even when the program is explicitly
asked to use something else, my only option is to never allow pulseaudio to
start, even if for some programs I would actually prefer that?
This brings back memories of security bugs in Windows programs in the 90s
which were claimed to be features by MS… MS has learned since…
Cheers,
Juha
Acknowledgement sent
to Elimar Riesebieter <[email protected]>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Debian ALSA Maintainers <[email protected]>.
(Thu, 22 Dec 2016 21:33:05 GMT) (full text, mbox, link).
* Juha Jäykkä <[email protected]> [2016-12-22 20:30 +0000]:
> > > > I think the only chance to run alsamixer without starting pulse is
> > > > to pulseaudio -k and autospawn pulse.
> > > Is this not a bug?
> > Starting pulseaudio automagic is a feature implemented in pulseaudio;-)
>
> So in short, it's either all or nothing? I.e. if I want *some* programs, which
> are linked against libpulse0,
Hmm, are there applications which need pulseaudio to work? I do have
a system which works fine without pulse. You can use pulse to
provide sound in a network which can other sound servers like
jackausio as well...
Elimar
--
355/113: Not the famous irrational number pi,
but an incredible simulation!
-unknown
> > So in short, it's either all or nothing? I.e. if I want *some* programs,
> > which are linked against libpulse0,
> Hmm, are there applications which need pulseaudio to work? I do have
There are, but probably best not mentioned aloud lest Stallman smites us. :)
> a system which works fine without pulse. You can use pulse to
> provide sound in a network which can other sound servers like
> jackausio as well...
Bluetooth audio without pulse..? (Not my usecase, but I think that's not
doable, is it? My use case is the one where I get the Vengeanceful Avengers of
Free Software smite me.)
Cheers,
Juha
Acknowledgement sent
to Elimar Riesebieter <[email protected]>:
Extra info received and forwarded to list. Copy sent to Debian ALSA Maintainers <[email protected]>.
(Thu, 22 Dec 2016 22:03:05 GMT) (full text, mbox, link).
* Juha Jäykkä <[email protected]> [2016-12-22 21:30 +0000]:
> > > So in short, it's either all or nothing? I.e. if I want *some* programs,
> > > which are linked against libpulse0,
> > Hmm, are there applications which need pulseaudio to work? I do have
>
> There are, but probably best not mentioned aloud lest Stallman smites us. :)
>
> > a system which works fine without pulse. You can use pulse to
> > provide sound in a network which can other sound servers like
> > jackausio as well...
>
> Bluetooth audio without pulse..?
It works with plain alsa ;-)
Elimar
--
355/113: Not the famous irrational number pi,
but an incredible simulation!
-unknown
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