Well, then I am going to jump in to say that insiders who jump in to assure us that due to their classified insider knowledge they can reassure us it's not like that at all... you realize this doesn't work, right? Not on anyone who doesn't already believe it. Even if you were right, you're simply not trustworthy.
There are two things I wish I could make you and your friends understand: one is how deep you've dug that credibility hole. There was a price to pay for all that secrecy.
The other is, when you're out here trying to manage the non-classified public's perceptions, why on earth would you trust that your bosses aren't managing yours? Why would you think you get to know what the long term plans are?
Ehh, I don’t work there anymore. Just got nerd sniped by someone being obviously wrong on the internet.
> one is how deep you've dug that credibility hole. There was a price to pay for all that secrecy.
It’s a weird thing that the public thinks the defense sector doesn’t know this. They’re aware. I could try and reason with you on the internet, but this isn’t a place for changing people’s opinions.
I would instead tell you that people who work in defense tech tend to be motivated by morals and any argument that what they’re doing is dangerous is an implicit argument that they’re intelligent (otherwise, it wouldn’t seem too dangerous).
So, given those two facts — you can probably do a better job of reasoning about their motives than this.
> The other is, when you're out here trying to manage the non-classified public's perceptions, why on earth would you trust that your bosses aren't managing yours? Why would you think you get to know what the long term plans are?
Just bored on HN on a Monday. Same as anyone. Obviously not working on classified stuff, or I wouldn’t have access to HN.
Just because things are secret from the public doesn’t mean the defense industry is some cloak and dagger affair. It’s painfully boring bureaucracy. Decisions happen on the order of weeks to years, across many meetings. Everyone in the room knows the long term plans.
> It’s a weird thing that the public thinks the defense sector doesn’t know this. They’re aware.
Their actions aren't consistent with being aware. Your post wasn't consistent with being aware. They think they understand, but they act in exactly the way they should not act, digging the hole of distrust deeper.
Look at Keith Alexander going to work for Mohammed bin Salman and Saud al-Qahtani. Is that consistent with being "motivated by morals"? Do you think everyone working under him understood that such were his personal long-term plans?
There are two problems with your argument. You’re trying to reason from a specific case to the general and your specific case isn’t even that great.
Keith Alexander retired from active duty 10 years ago. He’s now, currently, on the Amazon board of directors. Does this make every Amazon employee culpable for his actions?
Generally speaking, yes, it is not uncommon for leadership to contract with Saudi Arabia. I did not and continue to not offer any opinion about this nonsequitur. I do not think it’s at all common for them to share secrets. Further, I have no idea what this has to do with the morality of secrets as whole.
I gave an example, I did not "reason from a specific case".
The point is not that your organization gets "tainted" by Alexander's actions. You must answer for your own sins, whoever your leader is.
The point is that he was always that sort of person, and that's the sort of people who become your leaders. Yes, it's a problem that completely amoral people get high positions in business too, but Amazon board members are not quite as powerful as NSA chiefs - among other things, because Amazon is not as good at convincing its workers to identify with it, like you identify with your mil-int employers.
Sure, gp implied morality was absurd. I didn’t say it was always correct, only that it’s possible to be intelligent and motivated by some set of morals.
I don’t think most of this stuff is a secret… I watched one of the recent documentaries about the frantic exit of Afghanistan and its effect on the Afghan military. There were scenes where the military used drones on various targets, one dude made the decision at the end.
There are two things I wish I could make you and your friends understand: one is how deep you've dug that credibility hole. There was a price to pay for all that secrecy.
The other is, when you're out here trying to manage the non-classified public's perceptions, why on earth would you trust that your bosses aren't managing yours? Why would you think you get to know what the long term plans are?