That's kind of interesting. We always hear how much healthier Europe is then the US and there's always though things like American food is so fake it can't be sold in Europe. Seems the same problems are spreading or were always kind of there?
Been to Europe a couple times and I didn't think it seemed that much healthier. Italy especially, I put a ton of weight durring a vacation there.
> Italy especially, I put a ton of weight durring a vacation there.
What a bizarre datapoint this is. What should the fact you put on weight during a vacation prove? I can go anywhere in the world, eat like shit and just do nothing but sitting by the pool for the entire time I’m there and I’d probably come back home with added weight.
The fact that the United States rank 19th in the obesity ranking for example when Italy is 132nd is a better datapoint if you ask me.
Doesn’t tell the full picture of course, there are a million factors that contribute.
There doesn't seem to be anything inherently healthy or special about European food.
But this is a thing people say quite often and I think people believe if only we had more laws or w/e like Europe has the people of the US would suddenly be fitter.
> There doesn't seem to be anything inherently healthy or special about European food.
It depends how you look at it.[0]
> In the US, the FDA takes a notably more hands-off approach to testing and inspections, often allowing new food ingredients unless proven harmful. This includes ingredients, for example, GMOs, growth hormones and chemical preservatives. In Europe, the EFSA requires additives to be proven safe before approval and has banned the use of growth hormones and several chemical additives.
> These differing philosophies lead to certain additives being allowed in the US and banned in Europe. For instance, these eight ingredients are commonly used in the US but not in Europe: rBGH (rBST) – Growth hormone, Ractopamine – Increases lean muscle in animal stock, Potassium bromate – Makes baked goods whiter and increases volume, Brominate vegetable oil – Used to keep flavors from separating in beverages, Olestra – Fat substitute, Azodicarbonamide – Used to bleach flour
Coloring agents – Red #40, yellow #6, yellow #5, blue #1, BHA and BHT – Preservatives
Well no… but stuff like various leafy greens amongst other things seem be relatively extremely cheap in Italy compared to some other European countries to the North. This applies to some other products too.
The outcome is that it’s relatively cheaper to have a healthier diet and therefore more expensive to eat ultra-processed crap.
Of course at the end of the day individuals have to make that choice.
When people say food they’re usually not referring to the raw materials. They're talking about the food they eat when they’re abroad and is a reflection of the cuisine and the culture.
Also, talking about European food is a massive generalization considering how diverse the place is.
The average healthspan is approximately 70.7 years in the EU, compared to 63.9 years in the US, meaning Europeans tend to live longer in good health than Americans.
But averages kind of sucks for comparison. Id be interested to see the median of each country.
Adjusting by ___location, race and other factors makes a significant difference as well.
e.g. Hispanics generally have comparable life expectancy to top 10 European countries in most states. If you exclude the Black and non-Hispanic White population California is on par or above Spain and Italy (interestingly enough obesity is much more prevalent amongst the Latino than white population there).
(Asians are of course even higher but you have to take wealth/education into account)
I assume statistics could be found for that subpopulation.
And well.. I only mentioned Spain and Italy, not Sweden.
Regardless this seems besides the point? I just found it interesting that Hispanic Americans live longer than non-Hispanic whites despite being poorer and more overweight. They must be doing something right.
The article is saying that life expectancy is still improving in Europe, but it's improving at a slower pace than it used to improve in the past. In the United States, life expectancy started diverging from Western Europe in the early 90s and has had zero improvement in the last 15 years while Western Europe has continued to slowly improve.
The pandemic hit US life expectancy figures incredibly hard due to the very high levels of excess death compared to Western Europe, but presumably there might be a 'bounceback' due to natural selection of the aged population with the strongest immune systems and fewest comorbidities.
I've heard a lot of Americans comment on putting on a lot of weight while travelling in Europe. I can only imagine that Americans would be more accustomed to eating out for more of their meals. When cooking at home, I found the French to have a good sense of portion sizing and a cultural aversion to overeating; the sensation of being completely full was often described with a sense of discomfort and disgust. Whereas in Anglo cultures, being completely full is treated more positively.
Other countries I didn't feel like I had a weight issue. Specifically italy, it was lots of bread and pasta, slow cooked fatty meats, deep fried dishes, and sweet pastries.
In restaurants, yes, we eat salty, fatty, overcaloric stuff - because that is celebration food, not everyday fare. At home, day in day out, we cook leaner, simpler stuff, and eat less. Also, Italians tend to live in urban centers, often walking or cycling rather than driving everywhere.
I've been living in the UK for 20+ years, and every time I land back in Italy I suddenly feel obese, because people are so much thinner. After a few weeks of normal life there, I know why: I'm eating less, eating leaner, and moving more.
you were probably eating tons of pizza and noodles in restaurants while on vacation. But the people that life there, A: don't go to restaurants every day B: are they eating pizza everyday and C: have probably healthier behaviors than you, like using a bike tonget around etc.
If its cost continues to outpace inflation and GDP growth, it will consume an ever-larger share of the wealth generated by the private sector until it becomes unaffordable.
The current model is unsustainable. If you’ve had to visit an A&E recently or request an ambulance, you’ll know that the whole system is unfit for purpose and needs a rethink (not just another huge cash injection).
Those two also seem like diseases you get left with after you've been raising life expectancy for decades by avoiding death from other diseases, which is a more positive framing.
But people and societies can probably still make better choices in regard to the current priority diseases.
This article talks about food and BMI related problems though. The low US life expectancy is mostly from cultural problems IIRC? Drug over doses like from oxycodone and gun violence.
On average, USians live 13 year after they are considered "non-healthy". French, Spaniards, Italians live only 10 years after being considered "non-healthy) *this include demention and/or autonomy loss obviously), but live 4 more years total.
Sure, if by 'now' you mean since the 1980s on Usenet at least . . .
(I've been a regular user for decades, it's common enough outside the English as a primary language North North American bubble .. it's interesting seeing it make inroads on HN in the past few years)
FWiW the @tptacek usage I linked was from five months ago, prior to that little USofA parochial renaming fit .. although it does highlight that everyone about the "Gulf of Mexico (Gulf of America)" is, indeed, an American and it makes sense to differentiate them by country.
> the @tptacek usage I linked was from five months ago
That was clearly sarcastic use of the term.
> it makes sense to differentiate them by country
It strikes me as more a way to signal bias / a particular online group membership, sort of like that group that likes to capitalise random words, in a way that generally undermines credibility about anything geopolitical, but I suppose I appreciate that signal.
That predates the recent Yawning Gulf of America hoorah .. there are references going back to at least the 1980s online, and prominent USofA people of letters commenting on the laziness of using "Americans" back into the 1800s.
> It strikes me as more a way
Sure. A number of english speakers in the USofA do seem to feel that way. It's common practice for humans to make such things all about them.
> likes to capitalise random words,
The United States is a pairing of random words now? C'mon, you chaps haven't yet screwed the pooch that badly ... yet.
> but I suppose I appreciate that signal.
Back in the day, when I first encountered its regular usage, it was in international geodesy groups with a good number of people zeroing in the large numbers of traditional ellipsoid datum pairs to the new WGS84 reference standard.
It was less about signalling exclusion from the kids under the Canadian hat and more about precision of reference, particularly in a group that had many ESL members a good many of whom counted continents differently to the trad Western standard and had varying rules for indicating Asians, Europeans, Americans, etc. from citizens of specific countries.
You know, global geodesists with credible geopolitical backgrounds different to your own bubble. You can find much of their work in various GIS transform standards.
> in a way that generally undermines credibility
these things are both subjective and reflective. Some find the aggressive, passive or otherwise, projection of blinkered world views to undermine credibility.
I mean, I guess? I definitely think it's silly. But I didn't think of it as a loaded term when I used it, just a message-board-ism. It wasn't an ironic commentary. :)
(This is a very weird thread to have stumbled on by following your comments).
By the power vested in me by being mentioned in the third person on this thread I hereby decree that "US-ians" is a cromulent term. May God have mercy on your souls.
Been to Europe a couple times and I didn't think it seemed that much healthier. Italy especially, I put a ton of weight durring a vacation there.