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One thing that's always puzzled me: surely in the winter, when you have heating on, it doesn't really matter how efficient your appliances are - 'waste' heat from inefficient appliances will just replace heat that the heating system would generate otherwise?



In Canada, it turns out that switching from incandescent light bulbs to more "environmentally friendly" bulbs actually causes a net increase in CO2 emissions, since most of our electricity is hydroelectric, but most homes are heated using natural gas.


I'd like to see some stats on that. Not that I think you're wrong, just that for me it isn't completely obvious that incandescent bulbs are giving off that much heat.


it isn't completely obvious that incandescent bulbs are giving off that much heat.

All energy ends up as heat eventually. Since indoor lighting only leaks a very small amount of light (unless you've got an excessive number of windows), a 60W lightbulb will contribute to very close to 60W of heating.


Sure, but how many 60W bulbs on the ceiling are required to raise the temperature in a room 1 degree.

You seem to be suggesting that leaving my lights on all night has a positive environmental impact since it would significantly affect my furnace use.

I find that rather unintuitive, although possible; hence, citation required.


Sure, but how many 60W bulbs on the ceiling are required to raise the temperature in a room 1 degree.

Look at it this way: To raise the temperature by 1 K, you need to add X Joules of heat to the room, for some value X. Those X Joules can be added by burning approximately X * 9E-7 standard cubic feet of natural gas; by running a 1200 W electric heater for X * 2.3E-7 hours; or by leaving a 60 W light bulb turned on for X * 4.6E-6 hours.


Again, I'm not arguing the logic, I just want to see the supporting citation that shows how this translates into increased CO2 emissions for Canada, as you claim above.


Only if you have electric radiators. If you heat your home in any other way, you're wasting some energy, since electric energy is the least efficient to use for simple heating.


Well, not entirely true, depending on what you're optimizing for.

If it's cost, you need to see if gas bill savings + price difference of appliance < electric bill savings.

If you're optimizing for CO2 emissions, and live in France, with many nuclear plants, maybe using less electricity doesn't do much.

(I have ground source heating in my home, btw, and it's great for both!)


But in France the problem is that they built their houses according to the maxim "we have abundant cheap nuclear energy" to use marginal insulation and electric heaters, so these days they have to buy electricity produced in Germany's dirtiest coal power plants during winter...

Here is a (German, sorry) text from last winter: http://www.sol.de/titelseite/topnews/Strom-EDF-Frankreich-Ko...

This winter may become even more problematic, since about a quarter of their nuclear power plants are down for maintenance. http://weblog.greenpeace.org/nuclear-reaction/2009/11/france... http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssUtilitiesElectric/idUSLU2...


Indeed. It is amazing how much heat-per-watt of electricity you can get from a heat pump. Much better to use your electricity to power that than it is to use a bunch of old servers as your primary heat source. (Yes, I know someone who did this...)


It depends: A lamp in the ceiling produces heat into the wrong place -- most of the warm air is stuck up there and not where people are.

And as other people mentioned, house heating is often produced with more efficient methods.


Correct. That's often forgotten when promoting more expensive, efficient appliances.

For example, Ontario is banning incandesent lightbulbs. However, studies have calculated that because of the colder climate, there will be no net cost savings for the average consumer. Although the government is touting this as an environmentally justified decision, it's more due to Ontario's lack of electrical generating capacity. (which, granted, could be seen as an environmental issue, if you don't want a new nuclear plant in your back yard)




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